Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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LongtimeAirman
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by LongtimeAirman » Mon May 26, 2014 3:08 pm

Sparky said:
A hasty conclusion fallacy.
An Analysis of Dark Matter. A close reading of the dark matter pages at Wikipedia. 5pp. http://milesmathis.com/dark2.pdf

Miles estimates the mass of the charge from the 3 lines:
e = 1.602x10^(-19)C
1C = 2×10^(-7)Kg/s, (see olde definition of Ampere)
e = 3.204x10^(-26) Kg/s

Starting with the first two lines, Miles just came up with the third. Based upon the electron charge strength, it means that the electron is  emitting 35,000x its own mass in charge every second. The electron is made up from photon quanta that are constantly recycling charge. Similarly,  the proton's emission amounts to 19x its own mass every second.
You don't know what has not been discovered.
These are real photons. We now have a simple way of determining the energy/mass of the charge field.  It is 95% of the total energy/mass of the universe. That's a large mass imbalance that just happens to agree with the estimated values for dark matter.
And charge field of MM is repulsive.
Agree. I provided Miles' apparent attraction above.
Yet he has it attracting with magnets.
I don't see the contradiction. Please cite the source you are interpreting, or otherwise explain.
Be consistent
I think that Lloyd's method helps.

Sparky, I've read Distinti and seen several of his videos since you pointed to it back, I think in early Feb14. Do you have favorites to reccommend?

Chromium6. I have fallen behind in your reading list. Thanks for the interlude.

REMCB

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Mon May 26, 2014 6:11 pm

Science Improvement Procedure
I think I'm learning how to streamline evaluation of science theories. In this thread and on QDL etc, I've tried the method of listing individual statements from a paper so that each statement can be evaluated. I found that after listing all of the statements that relate directly to the theory, it's good to select just the key statements out of those, whether those statements seem plausible or implausible, then labeling the key statements as observations or arguments, which both can then be labeled as either probable or improbable. Focusing on the key statements avoids having to evaluate the other statements.

But I'm ready to try streamlining even further now. Instead of going through hundreds of papers or other material, I think it's better to simply go to the theorists or their supporters and ask for the name of the theory, the top 5 or fewer main subtheories, and 5 or fewer key points for any or all of these subtheories, and 5 or fewer main arguments for each of the key points (usually made as statements). Then get teams of judges to evaluate the key points and the supporting arguments and give each competing theory a grade from 0 to 100. The evaluation would point out all of the weak points or arguments of a subtheory, so theorists can attempt to improve the theory, the observations, or the arguments.

Distinti vs Mathis
I propose that we start having conferences between Distinti supporters and Mathis supporters. Theorists from different camps can cross-fertilize each other's theories to make them better. Both Mathis and Distinti seem to have gobs of good points. By finding the key points and arguments of each, we may be able to help them improve both theories.

Some of us had some good chat room chats yesterday and last week. This morning I was thinking QDL needs to start holding online conferences. We've formed teams to study several different topics. And Charles installed chat rooms or boxes in each team's workspace. It occurred to me this morning that having two or more chat boxes on one page might make it possible to have a good conference online. So I asked him about it and he said it would work and he's already tried it somewhere, but he has to check to see how much of a load they make. I guess that might be for those with slow internet, like mine, or maybe worse than mine.

I figure that up to 9 or even 12 chat boxes could fit on a single page. It should be possible for anyone to chat on any or all of the boxes that are available. Chat room chats usually have quite a bit of dead air or else if too many people are chatting it gets hard to follow who's talking to whom. Even if Charles can't get more than one chat box to work well on one page, it would still be possible for users to open several chat rooms in different windows.

Are yous ready for an online conference? I hope any potential bugs will be weeded out within a couple days or so.

Sparky
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Sparky » Tue May 27, 2014 7:55 am

I haven't gotten too deep into MM or Distinti's work.

I want to comment on MM's models. If spin is real, and the basis of his model, then each variation of spin would be a separate particle.?

Some quote bits found at http://milesmathis.com/magnet.html
the entire electromagnetic spectrum can be taken as a charge field.
the charge field is probably an average motion of the entire E/M field

Electricity is the linear or near-linear motion of free electrons and other quanta by a river of photons.
But magnetism is caused by the spin of those same photons.

This spin tends to be either a clockwise or a counter-clockwise spin,
magnetism works by either driving the E/M field out of a small area of space between the magnets, allowing only gravity to remain, or by augmenting the angular part of the E/M field, creating a greater repulsion than before.

There is too little repulsion to counteract gravitational expansion, and the magnets come together.

the acceleration of gravity to a real motion, not just a field inclination or a hovering gradient or a mathematical curve. That is to say, all objects are expanding at a rate defined by their gravitational presence, i.e, their volume.

you turn one of your magnets 180 degrees. Or, you have turned your macro-object upside-down. Just by doing that, you have turned all your quanta upside-down as well.
A complete reversal of 50/50 is still 50/50.

Yes, you can make a photon act like an antiphoton just by turning it upside-down.

we have eight different kinds of protons and eight different kinds of anti-protons, as well as four different electrons and four different positrons.
I have to agree with some of this, but then comes the MAJIK`! :roll:
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Tue May 27, 2014 6:30 pm

LongtimeAirman » Mon May 26, 2014 10:54 am
I'm posting my current Charge and Charge Field list for feedback.
What's the list for, Airman?

LongtimeAirman
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by LongtimeAirman » Tue May 27, 2014 8:44 pm

Sparky, I'm reformatting slightly for clarity.

Sparky wrote:
Some bits can be found at http://milesmathis.com/magnet.html 

I want to comment on MM's models. If spin is real, and the basis of his model, then each variation of spin would be a separate particle?  
Agreed. (I would say the basis of Miles' physics is the charge field, where photons are real and have mass and spin, but that's quibling). There are many possible spin combinations. How many forms of electrons or protons are there? We don't know. Some may not be stable, i.e. free neutrons. There are certainly lots of hadrons and such, and now we have a good reason why.
the entire electromagnetic spectrum can be taken as a charge field.
the charge field is probably an average motion of the entire E/M field 
Miles doesn't know whether all photons (the entire E/M spectrum) are charge field particles. It seems likely that high energy x-ray photons are not. The best candidates for charge field photons are from the low energy end of the E/M spectrum, infrared photons. I don't understand the, "an average motion" statement.  
Electricity is the linear or near-linear motion of free electrons and other quanta by a river of photons.
But magnetism is caused by the spin of those same photons.
I always say that bombarding photons impact with a force that can be described by two orthogonal components: the forward e, and the orthogonal (sideways) h. The sum of all the charge field e and h components results in the pre-electric and pre-magnetic fields. There will actually be no measurable E/M fields present until they are revealed by ions. 
This spin tends to be either a clockwise or a counter-clockwise spin,magnetism works by either driving the E/M field out of a small area of space between the magnets, allowing only gravity to remain, or by augmenting the angular part of the E/M field, creating a greater repulsion than before. 
 
OK. Spinning particles makes absolute sense to me. Long before I heard of Miles Mathis, one of my first personal software projects was developing a 3-d pool game. I spent a great deal of time thinking about spin and spin interactions. Maybe that was why I was so quick to accept Miles' charge field.
A magnet provides a coherent charge field, with strongly aligned e and h components. The interactions of two magnets, attraction and repulsion, can be described in terms of spin additions or cancellations. The only "attraction" Miles allows is that of gravity, but that's because matter behaves as though it were expanding at the rate of gravity (another contentious Miles idea).
Charge fields only repel. When magnetic like poles are brought toward each other the h and e fields add, and the result is repulsion. When magnetic unlike poles are brought together the h fields cancel and we are left with just e field repulsion and gravitational attraction. The gravitational attraction wins. This is a simple yet unexpected explanation of magnetism, based on spin.
There is too little repulsion to counteract gravitational expansion, and the magnets come together. 
The attraction of magnets is due to gravity. This is logically consistent, as I tried to describe in the previous reply. Try to see the sense of it before rejecting it.
the acceleration of gravity to a real motion, not just a field inclination or a hovering gradient or a mathematical curve. That is to say, all objects are expanding at a rate defined by their gravitational presence, i.e, their volume.
Miles has greatly simplified gravity mathematics, throwing out tensors and curved space, and replacing them with simple euclidean problems, by reversing the gravity vector from inward to outward. He just took Einstein's idea that there is no difference between an accelerating elevator or a gravity acceleration field. He doesn't say that all matter is expanding, but the math does suggest it.
you turn one of your magnets 180 degrees. Or, you have turned your macro-object upside-down. Just by doing that, you have turned all your quanta upside-down as well.A complete reversal of 50/50 is still 50/50.
Turning a magnet by 180 deg is the same as reversing the h field of the magnet, the field remained coherent, but it is reversed. If , instead of a magnet, you were to consider a non magnetic object, with no coherent h field, turning the object over does flip all the h components, but since they weren't coherent to begin with, they will not be coherent after the object is flipped.
Yes, you can make a photon act like an antiphoton just by turning it upside-down.
Yep. It's that simple. Matter-antimatter reactions don't annihilate, they just spin cancel.
we have eight different kinds of protons and eight different kinds of anti-protons, as well as four different electrons and four different positrons.
We've looped back to your first question above. There's still a particle zoo, but we can now see the sense of it. Miles hasn't provided all the answers yet, but what he has provided is a simple, comprehensive theory.
I have to agree with some of this, but then comes the MAJIK`!
I agree. I just think it's good MAJIK.

Lloyd, Why do you ask? The list is intended to be my glossary entry for Miles' charge or charge field. I offered it for comments. I'm grateful for replies. It's fun. I haven't figured out your suggested changes yet.

REMCB

Sparky
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Sparky » Wed May 28, 2014 5:47 am

The attraction of magnets is due to gravity. ------ Try to see the sense of it before rejecting it.
:? I find it difficult to accept that my little doggie magnets clink together because of gravity. :roll:
You and Miles are doing what standard model are doing to arrive at a proof, from maths.
:?
If I were standing in front of a photon and I turn myself upside down, would the photon morph into an antiphoton ? :roll:

And would the photon/antiphoton realize it's majik transformation? :roll:
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

LongtimeAirman
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by LongtimeAirman » Wed May 28, 2014 7:00 pm

S: :? I find it difficult to accept that my little doggie magnets clink together because of gravity. :roll:
A: Agreed.

S: You and Miles are doing what standard model are doing to arrive at a proof, from maths.:?
A: Disagree. The standard model's continued existence depends on maths too complicated for the majority of us to understand (superstrings, QED, QCD, singularities, Blach Holes, etc). Miles is doing a great job simplifying the maths. It is the implications, or changes in our understanding that are difficult.

S: If I were standing in front of a photon and I turn myself upside down, would the photon morph into an antiphoton ? :roll:
A: No. Spins and anti-spins are no more complicated than positive and negative numbers.

S: And would the photon/antiphoton realize it's majik transformation? :roll:
A: What do you think would happen if the earth were flipped, and all else remained the same?

REMCB

Sparky
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Sparky » Thu May 29, 2014 6:24 am

Spins and anti-spins are no more complicated than positive and negative numbers.
:roll:
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Thu May 29, 2014 7:36 am

Spin & Antispin
If a bullet is fired from a gun, the rifling in the barrel causes the bullet to spin. I don't know if the rifling is always the same or if some barrels are rifled opposite to normal, but it would be possible for it to make a bullet spin either to the right or to the left. The bullet is pointy in front and flat in back and it spins clockwise or counterclockwise in order to keep it from tumbling during flight and going off course.

Throwing a football is similar. A right-handed player causes the ball to spin counterclockwise, viewed from the front. A left-handed player causes it to spin clockwise, viewed from the front. A spherical ball can be thrown in the same way, to spin left or right. Mathis theorizes that photons must spin the same way. If two photons are moving side by side in the same direction, they can be spinning the same way or in opposite ways. If they're opposite, then one has antispin with respect to the other.

Si?

Sparky
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Sparky » Thu May 29, 2014 10:51 am

A right-handed player causes the ball to spin counterclockwise, viewed from the front.
That's what I'm getting at, the reference frame!! If you are talking about "real spin", then flipping a spin over will change it in reference to what or who?!

There is no such thing as upsidedown or rightsideup!! :roll:
It's easy to design spins as a model explanation to magnetic force, but absurd in reality.

The magnetic field is not composed of spinning photons, electrons, positrons, or anti-of any of those.! It is the aether, being distorted from it's fabric structure. You want to lay up a charge field on top of that, go ahead, but it is inconsistent to attempt to make the charge field out of the aether. Gravity and charge are separate from the aether. The "vacuum" space/aether is the source of energy, by way of magnetic and electric currents. And the aether energy is alignments, not spins.

Miles' model may work with spins, but in reality, he is conflating several forces, fields, and phenomenon. Magnetic field flux is aligned aether, from one pole to the other and through the magnet. Magnetic Flux Density Field is the amount of distortion of the aether. And at a quantum level, the field is lines of force.
But at that level, lines are so close that it appears as a continuum. ;) :oops:
"It is dangerous to be right in matters where established men are wrong."
"Doubt is not an agreeable condition, but certainty is an absurd one."
"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire

LongtimeAirman
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by LongtimeAirman » Thu May 29, 2014 6:08 pm

Sparky wrote:
That's what I'm getting at, the reference frame!! If you are talking about "real spin", then flipping a spin over will change it in reference to what or who?!There is no such thing as upsidedown or rightsideup!!  It's easy to design spins as a model explanation to magnetic force, but absurd in reality.
Disagreed. There is a reference frame. Our planet, our solar system, and our galaxy all share the predominant counterclockwise spin as seen from, say, the north star. Our main ambient charge fields are in accordance with that reference frame and it extends to all matter in our space. Roughly 2/3 of our local matter is CCW.
The magnetic field is not composed of spinning photons, electrons, positrons, or anti-of any of those.! It is the aether, being distorted from it's fabric structure.
Now, having declared a spin based magnetic field absurd, you are proceeding to argue your preferred theory, a magnetic field based on a distorted aether.

That is a separate question that deserves its own debate.

Lloyd, Agree mostly. "Mathis theorizes that photons must spin the same way" is not true.

REMCB

Chromium6
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Chromium6 » Thu May 29, 2014 10:25 pm

LongtimeAirman wrote:Sparky wrote:
That's what I'm getting at, the reference frame!! If you are talking about "real spin", then flipping a spin over will change it in reference to what or who?!There is no such thing as upsidedown or rightsideup!!  It's easy to design spins as a model explanation to magnetic force, but absurd in reality.
Disagreed. There is a reference frame. Our planet, our solar system, and our galaxy all share the predominant counterclockwise spin as seen from, say, the north star. Our main ambient charge fields are in accordance with that reference frame and it extends to all matter in our space. Roughly 2/3 of our local matter is CCW.
The magnetic field is not composed of spinning photons, electrons, positrons, or anti-of any of those.! It is the aether, being distorted from it's fabric structure.
Now, having declared a spin based magnetic field absurd, you are proceeding to argue your preferred theory, a magnetic field based on a distorted aether.

That is a separate question that deserves its own debate.

Lloyd, Agree mostly. "Mathis theorizes that photons must spin the same way" is not true.

REMCB
Sparky,

Give us a paper to look at. It is nice to have opinion and "your theory" but throw us a bone. I see "aether" only in terms of Mathis' Charge Field these days. Why? Because there exists an enormous confounding of "aether" with QED. We can theorize all day about it but at the end of the day we have to provide something that we all can work with. I like Mathis' work because of this - he gives us something to work with. In fact, I like it far more so than Distinti's vids only because Mathis gives us logically sound presentations in several papers. Without a paper, measurement, formula, etc. we can sit here all day and say "aether" powers butterfly wings in the EU. I'm actually surprised no one has asked Mathis to relate his spinning photons to quaternions or some other 3-D oriented math.

I would think Mathis' mechanical Charge Field explanations could be tied to quaternion math at the photon level over QED?

A book on Quaternion Physics
http://world.std.com/~sweetser/quaternions/ps/book.pdf

Some articles:
http://theworld.com/~sweetser/quaternio ... x.old.html
http://world.std.com/~sweetser/quaterni ... index.html

=======
Conclusion: Why is Anybody Using Quaternions Anyway?

Believe it or not, the quaternion vs. vector debate goes back more than 100 years. Quaternions were developed by William Rowan Hamilton around 1843 and immediately took their place in mathematical history as a solution in search of a problem. In 1901, just two years before his death, a Yale professor named Josiah Willard Gibbs published a treatise on vector algebra which included a definition of the vector dot product and vector cross product. Vector algebra was put forth as a simple, robust alternative to quaternions. Egos erupted, tempers flared, and the debate raged. Gibbs' vectors were championed posthumously by his colleague, Edwin B. Wilson, along with Oliver Heaviside in England. Quaternions were defended by Peter Guthrie Tait, but it was a losing battle. Vector algebra triumphed over its non-Euclidean predecessor, and the popularity of quaternions faded.

So why has the debate been re-ignited at the beginning of the 21st century?

Software engineers, in general, are not mathematicians. They can code an algorithm, but they rely upon others for a rigorous proof of an algorithm's suitability for a task. In this case, quaternions have been shown to effectively solve problems of 3D rotation and interpolation. But why has nobody looked beyond quaternions for a simpler solution until now? Perhaps they have, and we just haven't heard from them.

Quaternions lend themselves well to graduate projects and technical theses. They are very complicated, so describing them (and defending them) can take many words and many pages of formulas. Vectors, by comparison, are straightforward to the point of being boring. There is not much new to say about vector operations in R3.

Quaternions are a popular buzzword. They sound "cool". And their intrinsic difficulty is appealing. Only the most focused, deep-thinking programmers are able to understand and use them. But that is not enough to ensure that they are the right tool for the job. Sometimes it takes an open mind to look beyond the hype and consider the mathematical alternatives. As Mr. Brown would have admonished, you are not seeing the forest for the trees.

If you are considering using quaternions in a 3D graphics programming project, take some time to compare quaternion operations to their vector counterparts. You may find, as did Gibbs, Wilson and Heaviside, that quaternions are not the panacea some would have you believe

http://www.gamedev.net/page/resources/_ ... ions-r1199
On the Windhexe: ''An engineer could not have invented this,'' Winsness says. ''As an engineer, you don't try anything that's theoretically impossible.''

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Fri May 30, 2014 12:58 pm

LK: A right-handed player causes the ball to spin counterclockwise, viewed from the front.
Sparky: That's what I'm getting at, the reference frame!! If you are talking about "real spin", then flipping a spin over will change it in reference to what or who?!

There is no such thing as upsidedown or rightsideup!! :roll:
It's easy to design spins as a model explanation to magnetic force, but absurd in reality.
If you don't want to see a difference in the photon spins etc where there obviously is a difference, that just means you don't want to understand Mathis' theory. So, if you have nothing to contribute to this discussion, you may as well not be involved.
Last edited by Lloyd on Fri May 30, 2014 1:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Fri May 30, 2014 1:02 pm

Electric Current.
Miles, I've been trying to understand electric currents better, so I've been discussing "What Is Charge?" and "How a Battery Circuit Works" on the TB forum. "Airman" said there that "Work is done when the interacting charge fields from both battery terminals reaches the load." Do you agree with that? If so, I don't understand how the weaker charge stream from the "negative" terminal can enter the load seemingly against the stronger pressure from the other terminal. Can you explain?
MM: Well, I sort of agree, but his wording is imprecise. It could mean several things. I say everything I know in the battery paper, so it might be good to read it again. To answer your question, there is no pressure. You just made that up. It isn't pressure differences that matter here, it is density differences. You have density without much pressure, because the field is mostly uncontained. Charge creates so little real pressure you don't even have to track it. In studying the main motions, there is no need to look at pressure, and I never talk about it. To understand the effects, you should track the densities and the patterns, not the pressure. So there is nothing stopping the weaker stream from entering the lightbulb or whatever.
- You seem to be assuming that the stronger stream is creating the same density in the bulb that it had in the battery. But that is illogical. If that happened, then the stronger stream wouldn't move over there either. The bulb has to remain a low potential, which means it has to have a less dense field, even after the current flows. So both streams want to move over, but the strong stream moves much more, because the potential is greater.

Lloyd
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Re: Miles Mathis and his Charge Field

Unread post by Lloyd » Fri May 30, 2014 10:10 pm

I'm hoping we can have an online MM conference in a month or two or so. So I wrote up a list of 20 main points of MM's theory. I'd like to get your comments on this. Like does the phrasing of any of these points need to be revised? Are there some more important points that I've overlooked? I want to list main supporting arguments for each point in short form after fixing the list of main points.

MM Theory's Main Points?
1. Newton's, Maxwell's & Coulomb Equations are Unified Field Equations containing the formulas for Gravity and the Electric & Magnetic Fields.
2. Photons have mass, radius & spin.
3. Charge is a repulsive force between particles due to their photon emission via photon recycling.
4. Protons emit the most charge photons; Neutrons emit over 60% as much; Electrons emit very little.
5. Photons can have straight spins, or stacked spins, starting with a torus spin around a surface point, then a perpendicular spherical spin around the torus surface point, etc.
6. Stacked spins are caused by photon collisions.
7. Photons with high level stacked spins become electrons; electrons with high level stacked spins produce protons & neutrons.
8. Protons and electrons receive photons polarly and emit them equatorially; neutrons receive and emit polarly.
9. Neutral atoms receive and recycle most of their emitted charge photons; ions emit most of their charge photons to other ions or to the ambient photon charge field.
10. Atoms beyond hydrogen are built in stars based on deuterium and double deuterium, which forms helium.
11. Gravity is caused by universal matter expansion, or by stacked spins of the universe.
12. The electric field is the photon charge field.
13. The magnetic field is the photon charge field with coherent spin.
14. Heat is a dense photon charge field.
15. Electricity is work done on a load by a conductor-guided photon charge field.
16. Radioactivity is radiation from breakage of unstable atoms.
17. Albedo is due to magnetic and electrical effects of the photon charge field.
18. Solar Wind is solar emission of ions repelled by the emitted photon charge field.
19. Atmosphere is buoyant gases and plasma in balance between gravity and the emitted photon charge field.
20. Plant nutrients are carried upward by the Earth's emitted photon charge field.

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