The Boring Sun

Beyond the boundaries of established science an avalanche of exotic ideas compete for our attention. Experts tell us that these ideas should not be permitted to take up the time of working scientists, and for the most part they are surely correct. But what about the gems in the rubble pile? By what ground-rules might we bring extraordinary new possibilities to light?

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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Fri Apr 19, 2019 9:03 pm

The dark image of the Lunar far side taken by the camera on the Beresheet probe is the photograph as recieved by SpaceIL. The Space.com web site must have learned of that and replaced the adjusted image with the original. I downloaded the dark one and some basic level adjustments with the Gimp reproduced the adjusted version.
The SpaceIL web site does not yet show or discuss the images, but on the social media blogs the members discuss how they didn't like the original photos so adjusted them and went as far as making their images grey scale. Similarly, the radio hams who have been downloading images from the camera the Chinese have in orbit on the far side adjusted their images to elimiminate the purple hue, and believed the purple was due to overexposure. An overexposed image would be white, and the purple is most likely an effect of the camera having boosted the gain way up in order to capture the extremely dark scene.
Cleaned up footage from Apollo 11 allows for a better understanding of the lighting conditions they encountered. One thing to notice is that the video from the Vidicon based camera has some ghosting, and this is due to the gain of the camera being high, resulting in persistence of the brighter objects. Aldrin asks command for exposure settings for shadow photography on the sequence camera (DAC)to take the footage from the lander. After a delay, command tells him "f/2 at 1/160". According to NASA info though the camera did not have a 1/160 setting, maybe he meant 1/60?
Here is the DAC footage:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d73jCthcAok
The image can be seen to brighten when he adjusts the settings.That indicates a very dark scene ad the lit surface appears blindingly bright. The film was also capable of being 'pushed' so could have been brightened during processing. Then he can be heard saying how he was having difficulty seeing, it was very dark in the shade. If the lunar surface was as bright as we are lead to believe though, then scattered light should have given sufficient illumination to be able to see quite well, and the DAC footage does show illumination of Armstrong and his back pack from scattered light. The ground must have been very dark indeed in the shadow.
This low light I believe is due to the time that they landed on the surface and their location. As NASA gained experience with and understanding of the strange nature of the lighting conditions, they improved their photos and video footage with every mission, and by A17 they really did an impressive job. Kubrick was advising no doubt. NASA also had learned enough to know where and at what times to be on the surface to have the best lighting conditions. So yes, the lighting on the near side can be quite bright, especially to astronauts who have been kept dark adapted during the 3 day trip.

"There is no dark side in the moon, really. Matter of fact, it's all dark."
A little voice at the end of Eclipse, Pink Floyd:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9xOl8qZ7tc
Waters was a good friend of Kubrick.

From the adjusted image it can be seen that the Sun must have been almost directly behind the camera and the backscatter at maximum, so the dark original image is very telling.
Image
Textbook big hex crater for sure.

The far side is darker than the near side as there is no Earthshine. It is even darker than I expected. This fact is unlikely to concern NASA though, it seems that even the scientific community will never question them, let alone the general public, who will go on believing that because the Moon appears so bright from Earth that it must be blindingly bright, and hot, on the surface.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby allynh » Tue Apr 23, 2019 1:43 pm

In my checking the OSIRIS-REx site I spotted this picture. It was assembled from different shots and each part adjusted, so we are not seeing an actual untouched picture of stars taken in one shot.

The brightest dots coming out are close particles/debris being expelled, the fainter are stars?

Look at the full view and see if it is useful.

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/file ... jets_0.jpg

NASA Mission Reveals Asteroid Has Big Surprises
https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa ... -surprises
This view of asteroid Bennu ejecting particles from its surface on January 19 was created by combining two images taken on board NASA’s OSIRIS-REx spacecraft. Other image processing techniques were also applied, such as cropping and adjusting the brightness and contrast of each image.

Credits: NASA/Goddard/University of Arizona/Lockheed Martin
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Wed Apr 24, 2019 11:36 am

The brightest dots coming out are close particles/debris being expelled, the fainter are stars?


Could be, but the OSIRIS-REx instruments are not Bayer filtered visible light cameras like the Beresheet used, and the Beresheet camera at Bennu would have seen absolutely nothing, way too dark. The MapCam, tested from Earth is quite capable of imaging a galaxy and stars, but we will not see images like this from Bennu, it requires Earths atmosphere to do so.
Image

The China and Israel cameras are the first true colour cameras to ever view the far side of the Moon. The purple tint of the Chinese images of the far side are due I am told to the "difficult photography conditions of space", though what that difficulty is I am not told. We will never see such a thing as an LPO (Lunar Photographic Orbiter) that just uses a Bayer filtered camera with a zoom lens such as the Leica APO-Telyt-R f/5.6 1600mm telephoto lens. ($2.6 million)
Image
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Thu May 09, 2019 11:19 am

No response as yet from the SpaceIL team concerning the Beresheet Lunar far side photos. There is no discussion of this on any mainstream science site and only 2 comments that I have found. Without more information about those images regarding exposure settings it is not possible to say that it really is so dark. Automatic exposure or manual, and if manual were the settings based on the assumed solar constant and known reflectivity of the surface, illumination angles and viewing angle?
I am more convinced than ever that the Atmospheric Light Transformer model is the correct one, but if so then the implications for everything we are told about what is out there and how far away it is believed to be all go into the garbage can. It is very frustrating that the truth is so near yet impossible to verify, and this is the main reason I believe that NASA avoids the subject and diverts our attention with promises of Mars colonies, Hubble eye candy and pictures of black holes nonsense, and the public laps it all up. It will have to be a privately funded and fully independent mission that eventually conducts the empirical scientific experiments that destroys all present models, but will that ever be allowed to happen? Despite its claims of being a private company SpaceIL could not have achieved what it did without the Israel military and NASA. And just a guess, but the computer reset that prevented the engine firing during the landing may have been due to an electrical discharge.

Looking into the history of lunar orbital photography is interesting.

Lunar Orbiter program.
5 NASA missions,1966 through 1967, to determine possible landing locations.

"Lunar Orbiter 4 photographed the entire nearside and nine percent of the far side, and Lunar Orbiter 5 completed the far side coverage.."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Orbiter_program

So there are photos of the far side, and they are available in a digital library now:
Digital Lunar Orbiter Photographic Atlas of the Moon
https://www.lpi.usra.edu/resources/luna ... tion.shtml

This pdf file explains the photography, scanning and transmission to Earth process
Kodak Panchromatic Negative Films for Aerial Photography
https://www.asprs.org/wp-content/upload ... 95-699.pdf

The film used was SO-243 and a Wratten 25 filter was installed.
Wratten 25 is tricolour red band, blocks below 580 nm, used for infrared photography.

There have been up until now no colour photographs of the lunar far side.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Jun 22, 2019 6:41 pm

Is Transient Lunar Phenomena Electric?
https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2019/0 ... pace-news/

Observation of TLPs is performed from Earth, and some reported bye the naked eye even. To be seen by eye from Earth the visible light flash would need to be extremely bright and rather large. There was some mention before the LADEE mission was launched that it may be able to confirm these events but there seem to be no subsequent publications. I see nothing from LRO but its field of view maybe too narrow to have been looking in the right place at the right time.
With the Apollo astronauts having noted the glass and glass coated rocks in most of the small craters they examined it is most likely then that the event is electrical and that the flash is at UV or higher wavelengths and that it is Earths atmosphere that is producing the visible light. As some of the TLPs have been reported to have displayed an assortment of colours I believe the colours would depend on the excitation of the atmospheric molecules by the appropriate levels and wavelengths produced by the TLP.
Of course NASA will not send a Bayer filtered visible light camera to a lunar orbit so all observations will continue to be from Earth and the real answer to the puzzle will not be revealed.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby lindagriffithh » Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:15 am

So you are not looking for documents, and images. Or what did you mean?
Google has operators to find an exact match. Take your words in quotes - then Google will find them exactly.
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:13 pm

Hi lindagriffithh,
What do you mean what do I mean? :D
If you are referring to the TLPs then I have tried all the combinations I can think of for observations from space, the LRO, LADEE etc and always get "no results were found.." so I don't believe there are any such observations.

50 years tomorrow since I watched the Apollo 11 landing, where does the time go?
Here are a could of observations from the Apollo missions, one from the surface and one from lunar orbit which demonstrate the difficulty in trying to assess just how bright the lunar surface really was:

Neil Armstrong described the appearance of the lunar surface as seen from within the LM cabin as follows:
It's a peculiar thing, but the surface looked very warm and inviting. It looked as if it would be a nice place to take a sunbath • • • From the cockpit the surface seemed to be tan. It's hard to account for that, because later when I held this material in my hand, it wasn't tan at all. It was black, grey and so on."

From orbit:
Seen from within the comparatively dim cabin, the intensely illuminated surface appeared almost white, but when compared with the truly white Beta cloth covering of the space suit it was perceived as being very dark. The complex dependence of visual perception upon many variables was a major cause of uncertainty in lunar visibility predictions.


50 years on and still no actual visible light photometry values for the daytime lunar surface, not that I can find anyway.
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:33 pm

How does the Sun produce heat and light enough to sustain life on Earth?

Electric Light
https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2019/0 ... c-light-2/

Assumptions.
The sciences use assumptions which can be classified as reasonable or unreasonable, and the model of the Sun in which it produces large amounts of heat or light seems like a reasonable one. If we stand out in the Sun then we can feel the intense heat and see the blinding light, what can be unreasonable about that?
The true fact though is that the visible light from the Sun or the thermal infrared emissions have never been directly measured from outside of Earths atmosphere, and scientifically it must be acknowledged that there are processes whereby non-visible light can be converted to visible light or thermal infrared. One such process is by the interaction of ionising radiation with matter. The wavelength and intensity of the radiation impinging upon certain types of matter will determine the wavelength and intensity of the radiation emitted by such matter. Earths atmosphere contains much matter of various composition so it is possible that the light and heat we receive on Earth could be produced by the conversion of shorter wavelength photons to longer ones. Is that idea an unreasonable assumption? Why assume anything when the tests are so simple to perform?
...
SpaceIL will not be sending another Beresheet craft to attempt another Moon landing. "Not enough of a challenge", they say. Although the engine failure was due to "an external command" to the computer, we are not told who sent the command and why, but being the suspicious type, I wonder if the command may not have originated from the Beresheet control center at all? ;)
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:33 pm

The Dynamic Sun
https://www.thunderbolts.info/wp/2019/0 ... namic-sun/

Google"How is the temperature of the Sun measured?"

Colour=temperature. Assuming the Sun a blackbody.

"The sun emits maximum at the visible or yellow wavelength and the corresponding temperature is about 6000 degree Kelvin."

That's interesting, particularly when there is absolutely no scientific proof that the Sun is visible from outside of Earths atmosphere. Active cavity radiometers were used by ACRIMSAT at an altitude of 700km in a polar orbit. A polar orbit means the instrument must have been viewing the Sun through a long column of Earths upper atmosphere. Of course we will never see the radiometer or a pyrheliometer used from outside of Earths atmosphere, or from a high equatorial orbit when looking away from Earth. How have they gotten away with their charade for so long?
http://www.acrim.com/
In order to change an existing paradigm you do not struggle to try and change the problematic model. You create a new model and make the old one obsolete. -Buckminster Fuller
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby Sci-Phy » Mon Aug 19, 2019 9:23 am

GaryN wrote:The Dynamic Sun
Colour=temperature. Assuming the Sun a blackbody.

"The sun emits maximum at the visible or yellow wavelength and the corresponding temperature is about 6000 degree Kelvin."



There are two formulas for blackbody radiation - energy spectra vs. wavelength and spectra vs. frequency.
Those formulas giving us different results. The formulas are well recognized and published everywhere. Interestingly two formulas produced very different results for the maximum of radiation.
Which one you refer to?
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:58 pm

Sci-Phy
Which one you refer to?

Neither are applicable if the Sun is not a blackbody. The boffins at a military R&D facility informed me that the best way to take a photo of the Sun from space was by using a Neutral Density filter as it reduces all wavelengths equally and would give a good approximation to the true colour of the Sun, which I am told will be white when viewed from space. A regular camera with an ND filter however, or any other type of the popular ones, has not been taken into space by any of the space capable nations on any of their missions.
I am told by mainstream scientists that we do not need to take a photo of the Sun from space (not just LEO) as we can see it perfectly well from Earth, why duplicate the effort? From Earth we are obviously looking through the atmosphere, and I contend that it is Earths atmosphere that transforms the shorter, invisible wavelenth solar radiation to both visible and thermal IR radiation, and to test my belief it would require that a a camera/filter/exposure settings similar to those we would employ from Earth be used from space so a comparison could be made of the captured images. That no space agency from any country has taken a real photo of the Sun from space suggests strongly to me that it is not possible, but were that so I am obviously suggesting a conspiracy amongst all these agencies, for which I will likely get a telling off from the moderators about.
The SDO craft in geosynchronous orbit around the Earth does have what is called a White Light filter at 4500 Å showing the photosphere, which should be blue, but so as not to confuse us they colour it yellow, even though they tell us the photosphere is white. Hmm...
Image
None of the space based solar observing instruments function in the way that a regular camera with a solar filter does, so we will never know if it is visible by eye in space, but as the Apollo crews never so much as mentioned the appearance of the Sun from cislunar space we just have to accept mainstreams contention that it is visible. The only photo of what I belive is the Sun, taken after having photographed the solar corona from lunar orbit during A15 was taken with the very high speed 2485 film with no filter, the exact opposite of what we would do from Earth.
( The site will not allow me to post this image and reel 98 does not exist in the Flickr Project Apollo Archive )
https://www.lpi.usra.edu/resources/apol ... /13399.jpg
My belief is that it is the fine lunar atmospheric dust that made the Sun visible, and then only with the use of the most sensitive military spec.film and no filter.
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:24 pm

Another bright and sunny day on the Lunar far side as seen by Yutu-2
https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/dAYkB ... 650-80.jpg
.
Image
Yutu-2 found a strangely-colored substance in a crater on the far side of the moon
One possible explanation, outside researchers suggested, is that the substance is melt glass created from meteorites striking the surface of the moon.

An electrical discharge more likely.
https://www.space.com/china-far-side-mo ... tance.html
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Re: The Boring Sun

Unread postby GaryN » Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:20 pm

Image
Another one bites the Lunar dust. Indias valiant attempt to land on the moon seems to have been lost. They are still trying to identify the cause. I watched it live and all went well for the first few minutes, the telemetry was showing the lander following the projected curve till just a few kilometres to the surface and then took a step drop off the projeced line and contact was lost just above the surface. It was painful to watch all those truly dedicated people involved grow restless as the silence lengthened. The prime minster eventually spoke some encouraging and complementary words and looked forward to future endeavours.

The similarity to the Israeli attempt might raise suspicions in the minds of those so inclined. Who dunnit? I think I might have the reason for both lost attempts. Looking at the components of the landers I see the methods they used to guide the lander down were quite complex and the train of events leading to touchdown very touchy. Everything needed to happen exactly as planned at just the right time. I think the hardware and mission design were outstanding, so what went wrong?
Part of the landing system employed radar to gauge elevation, and what I suspect in both cases is that they overlooked the existence of radio reflective ion plasma boundary layers above the lunar surface, which the instruments and computer identified as the surface, and the thruster was shut off before it should have been. It may have started up again if the craft passed through the boundary layer but too late to prevent a destructive impact.
Maybe the thing went into a safe mode and will recover but I really doubt it. Be interesting to see if the engineers do figure it out, maybe I should E-Mail them?
https://www.geek.com/news/india-loses-c ... t-1803159/
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