Apparently Stars can form within reach of Black Hole?!?

[neilwilkes]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28506976/

Without too much comment really.
Apparently the latest woolly thinking & frantic Back-Pedalling says that - and this is a quote from the article -

The finding suggests that the molecular gas at the center of the Milky Way from which the stars form is denser than previously thought. The higher density gas makes it easier for the self-gravity of the condensing cloud to overcome the strong pull of the black hole and to collapse to form new stars.

And then (not surprisingly) the now familiar

"We don't understand the environment at the galactic center very well yet," Humphreys said.

So - Relativity & the Gravitational models didn't predict this then. What a surprise.

[Solar]

"We don't understand ...

Amazing. What a confession!

Yet, they still promulgate the myth in the face of such staggering contradictions to the theory while building computer simulations to match observations based on those contradictions. These antics put a hellacious scar on "science" and reveals a purely "faith based" paradigm.

These guys need to act like "hypervelocity stars" and get away from "black holes" as fast as they can. They're dragging a corpse. From the article you cite:

The finding suggests that the molecular gas at the center of the Milky Way from which the stars form is denser than previously thought. The higher density gas makes it easier for the self-gravity of the condensing cloud to overcome the strong pull of the black hole and to collapse to form new stars.

Yet, in another article from the same media source one finds:

Black holes rank among the greatest enigmas of the universe. Scientists theorize black holes have gravitational pulls so powerful that nothing, including light, can escape after falling past a border known as the event horizon. - Black hole effect created in lab

[MGmirkin]

The finding suggests that the molecular gas at the center of the Milky Way from which the stars form is denser than previously thought. The higher density gas makes it easier for the self-gravity of the condensing cloud to overcome the strong pull of the black hole and to collapse to form new stars.

Are they saying that the denser gas "overcomes" the gravity of the black hole? IE, is the gas more dense than the black hole? Wouldn't it have to be for "self-gravity of the condensing cloud to overcome the strong pull of the black hole and to collapse"?

I mean, how does that work exactly?

[Solar]

Are they saying that the denser gas "overcomes" the gravity of the black hole? IE, is the gas more dense than the black hole? Wouldn't it have to be for "self-gravity of the condensing cloud to overcome the strong pull of the black hole and to collapse"?

I mean, how does that work exactly?

LMAO!!! You're exactly right. It doesn't work exactly because it's a blatant paradoxical contradiction and reveals the absolute failure of the model.

[mnemeth1]

LOL

I just made a post about this on the advancedphysics boards.

I don't know what it will take for them to actually acknowledge their concept of the universe is ridiculously flawed but this one just seems like a giant hand slapping them in the face.

[Grey Cloud]

I can't figure out which is at the centre of the Milky Way. Is it the dense cloud of gas or the Black Hole?

We don't understand the environment at the galactic center very well yet," Humphreys said.

Obviously a graduate of the No-shit Sherlock School of Science.

[davesmith_au]

... Obviously a graduate of the No-shit Sherlock School of Science.

ROFLSHIJPMP!!!

[earls]

The black hole causes the gas to increase in density high enough that it's velocity is so high it slingshots the hole instead of falling in.

Is how I understand it....

[junglelord]

Well I do not understand it.
Somehow angular momentum wins again...but this time I am not buying it.


Now if you present a plasmoid that creates matter at the center of each galaxy and angular momentum allows it to exit the plasmoids gravity, that would be an electric rail gun...

[JohnMT]

Hi all,

I've often wondered how a 'black hole' (note: phrase not capitalized), can form in the center of a galaxy in the first place.
Was it once a supernova?

[earls]

Good question JohnMT. According to the first mainstream source I found...

"Stars and interstellar gas are flung into the heart of the galaxy, gases by the effect of friction and stars by the gravitational forces which causes one star that passes by another to get flung inward toward the core, while the other gets flung outward. The overall effect of all this is to drive some gas and stars into the center of the galaxy.

As this continues to happen, the gravity of the clump they form gets stronger and stronger. Eventually, the gravity may become strong enough to overcome the star's internal forces and a black hole will be formed. Or, in a different situation, stars massive enough in the center clump may form their own small black holes, which can collide with the other small black holes at the center until one large black hole is finally formed."

Haha. What?

However, new research suggests that perhaps streams of "cold gas" can choose a spot to collide, in which case the point of collision of such masses would form a black hole...

http://www.physorg.com/news151766798.html

An EU interpretation of the area of a "black hole" in a galaxy resolves most of these issues in my mind. As I mentioned in another thread, instead of being an area from which nothing can escape, it seems to me that a "black hole" is the area that which nothing can enter without being vaporized and flung into space via the galactic jets.

[Grey Cloud]

Hi earls,
You're going to get banned from physorg if you carry on like that.
I gave up half way through the actual physorg article. Even allowing that it is journalism rather than a scientific paper, it was piss-poor. Galaxies formed by merging galaxies; hot and cold running gas; massive gravitional pull of dark matter around the perimeter of a galaxy which contains a black hole with ...yes, you guessed it, massive grivtational pull. These poor galaxies don't know whether they are coming or going.
I gave up on physorg about a year ago once I realised that the (mainstream) reader comments were more sensible than the actual articles.

[Total Science]

No such thing as a black hole.

"...the 'Schwarzschild singularities' do not exist in physical reality." -- Albert Einstein, mathematician, 1939

If stars can form near a black hole then they can also form near invisible pink unicorns.

Gravity is a myth.

"An atom differs from the solar system by the fact that it is not gravitation that makes the electrons go round the nucleus, but electricity." -- Bertrand Russell, physicist/philosopher, 1924

[nick c]

No thread on Black Holes in an Electric Universe forum would be complete without a link to Stephen J. Crothers, The Black Hole Catastrophe and the Collapse of Spacetime
http://www.thunderbolts.info/thunderblo ... jc_bhc.htm

[SpaceTravellor]

Hi again,

Unfortunately I was by some reason interrrupted writing the reply above, so I´ll try again:

Of course Stars can be formed out of a "black hole"! It´s all very simple!

It´s even that simple that our ancestors all over the World have discovered this as a fact, and told just that in their Story of Creation in connection with our galaxy, the Milky Way!

Our Ancestors Story of Creation even claims that our Solar System was born directly out of the center of our galaxy!

When the modern science now instrumentally observes new born stars in the center of our Galaxy, this just confirms the ancient mythical stories of Creation, specially connected to the Milky Way Galaxy.

Interpreted and translated, our mythical common/global story of Creation goes: In the beginning was nothing created; a great light sets the matter alive; gas- and dust is set in swirling movements; the swirling accelerates, concentrates and heats up the gas and dust; when reaching a critical melting point, it all explodes horisontally of the swirling plane; slinging out larger spheres of gas and matter from the center which becomes Stars, Planets, Moons and all kinds of minor lumps of matter in the new born galaxy.

This outgoing movent in our Milky Way galaxy is described in all myths as "the Exodus of Eden" in which the "Tree of Life" is standing in the center.

- There is really NO contradictions between ancient and modern cosmological knowledge - the contradictions is created only by the instrumental way of gathering knowledge compared to the spiritual intuitive and natural way.

There is a BIG differens between looking at the Creation in the Universe from the "linear time/space" point of view compared to the natural ancestral Circular or Cyclic points of view. The linear method is measuring "frozen pictures in time" but the ancestral knowledge describes both the former state and the actual state of a structure and the ongoing movement and transitions.

- I´m sure that the near future will prove our ancestrial knowledge to be really more superior to the modern science when it comes to the full natural and logical understanding of the Creation in the Universe.

For more informations and inspirations, feel very welcome to visit my websites.

All the Best from Ivar