Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Historic planetary instability and catastrophe. Evidence for electrical scarring on planets and moons. Electrical events in today's solar system. Electric Earth.
evcochrane
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by evcochrane » Wed Apr 28, 2021 4:17 pm

Inasmuch as the vast majority of my published works have focused on the role of Mars and Venus in the recent catastrophic events celebrated by our ancestors I will confine my remarks to those two planets and leave the Saturn material to Dave Talbott and others familiar with his writings. As an introduction to the debate between Rens and the planetary catastrophists, perhaps a good starting point is his claim that the myths surrounding Mars/Venus "are satisfactorily reducible to these bodies' familiar appearance and behaviour" and thus warrant a uniformitarian explanation. This claim is demonstrably false and logically fallacious from start to finish. Consider Venus's intimate connection with gardens, attested around the globe, first in the earliest Sumerian texts describing the sacred marriage involving Inanna/Venus and then in the sacred traditions of the Skidi Pawnee of the North American Plains (for details readers can consult On Fossil Gods and/or Starf*cker where the respective myths are discussed at great length). In both cultures Venus is conceptualized as a beautiful woman who had sex with another star, thereby producing all living things. I submit that it is quite impossible to explain this manifold constellation of mythemes attached to Venus by reference to the present behavior and/or appearance of that planet. Now consider the furious, raging character universally ascribed to the planet Mars: As I have documented in Martian Metamorphoses and numerous other writings, this motif is attached to Nergal in ancient Mesopotamia (c. 2000 BCE), Ares and Heracles in ancient Greece, and the Skidi Mars in North America. Skidi rituals celebrating Mars's conquest of Venus actually make the male actor personifying Mars claim that he is becoming angry just like his celestial avatar. Does Mars currently present the appearance of a raging, furious berserker? Equally problematic for uniformitarian theorists is the incontestable fact that the "raging" of Mars typically occurs in an apocalyptic, cataclysmic context. According to various ancient accounts, the raging of the Martian warrior scattered the gods (=stars) and or threatened the world with destruction. To be continued.

evcochrane
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by evcochrane » Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:18 pm

In pondering such questions I think it is important to emphasize that the catastrophist approach is an entirely new way of viewing natural history. By way of illustration: Earlier today Public Radio's On Point program carried an hour long interview with Ken Farley, the lead scientist on the Mars Perseverance mission (see the first link below). It is a fascinating discussion and should be of interest to all members of this forum. There you will learn that "there is textbook evidence of running water on Mars," especially in the crater in which the rotor craft landed, and thus the team is optimistic about possibly finding primitive forms of microbial life. As Farley emphasizes again and again, liquid water hasn't flowed on Mars for over 3 billion years and thus any life forms found must date to that period. This consensus view stands in marked contrast to what the catastrophists would predict. Indeed, in anticipation of the Perseverance landing, I offered the following You Tube video detailing what Talbott, Thornhill, and I think about Mars:

https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2021/04/28 ... tand-earth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRvyAncwEAc

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JP Michael
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by JP Michael » Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:54 am

Thank you very much evcochrane for the response here and private correspondence. :)

I would thus like to issue a needed correction:
JP Michael wrote:it is time to put the Saturnian aspect of the Polar Configuration theory to bed.
I think van der Sluijs may have been a little too hasty in his dismissal of mytheme 'constellations' regarding the past activities of Venus and Mars, and the utter impossibility that they describe the present conditions and activities of those planets. I will add as a caveat, however, van der Sluijs' observation that some mythemes are applicable to multiple celestial bodies. I have not yet made my way through Starf*cker and Fossil Gods, but I suspect what might significantly boost the scholarship in this area is careful attention and reporting of confusion of planetary depictions, even if it threatens one's own theory. Now more than ever, there is a need to be detailed and avoid any possible pretense of "cherry-picking" data which only suits the theory.

Thus, there still remains a place in Polar Configuration theory for these planets, Mars and Venus, and their potential past epochs of eyewitnessed catastrophic interaction with our blue orb. But Rens is also right, in that we do not need another straight-jacket for interpretation, that it's planets or bust. We must keep all options on the table, both planetary and non-planetary.

What is far less certain, and I am sure Ev will agree with both Rens and myself at this point, is the role of Saturn as the 'primordial Sun'. Saturn's attestation as sun-god is mostly late and geographically limited to the ancient Near East. There is simply no currently known attestation of Saturn as sun anywhere else in other traditional cosmologies. Talbott's treatment of Saturnian themes is questionable on methodological grounds, especially when he deploys various "Saturnian" mythemes to search amongst the gods for their appearance without acknowledging that other planetary actors could also have those characteristics applied to them. Ra, Horus, Adam: everything with one of the Saturnian mythemes can be Saturn with this method, even if the source material expressly denies the association (and as Ev points out elsewhere, Horus is more likely to have been Mars, not Saturn).

I look forward to delving into this matter at more length later.

PS: Rens introduced himself in our private correspondence as "Tony". I do not yet feel privy to call him by the latter, but to avoid confusion with Tony Peratt I will use that or van der Sluijs from now on.

evcochrane
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by evcochrane » Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:07 pm

Naturally, it would be impossible in a forum such as this to reproduce the voluminous evidence presented by Talbott and myself in favor of recent incidents of planetary catastrophism. The fact that much of the evidentiary basis for the theory remains unpublished is also an unfortunate hindrance to successful communication, needless to say. That said, I'd like to offer a few remarks that might clarify a few of the issues raised by JP and Rens. Consider the earliest pictograph denoting Inanna as the planet Venus (no idea how to include an image here, so imagine the so-called Gatepost with streamer, a spiraling comet-like form). This particular image occurs in the earliest strata of Uruk with pictographic writing (Uruk IV), circa 3300 BCE and, in fact, is among the most popular pictographs from this period. All scholars accept that it describes the planet Venus, in large part because Mesopotamia, unlike virtually every other ancient culture, maintained a consistent and scientific approach to astronomy throughout the millennia. Remarkably, however, this incredibly popular pictograph depicting Sumer's greatest astral divinity, disappears from the script shortly thereafter. How is this fact to be explained? The most logical explanation is that this particular pictograph encodes Venus's comet-like history wherein it was orbiting around the polar column while presenting a comet-like tail. As Talbott and I have documented, once Venus became stabilized in the polar column (this in conjunction with the planet Mars, which appeared in "front" of it), the heaven-spanning tail disappeared (or better, took on a different appearance altogether, long story). As Dave and I have documented in various works, images identical to Inanna's pictograph (the so-called Mush sign) will be found around the globe, not only in Minoan Greece but along the Northwest Coast of the New World. What are we to make of this evidence? I'd like to think it should be obvious that we should hardly expect the indigenous natives of British Columbia to preserve the connection to Venus inasmuch as they did not have a scientific astronomy and never developed writing. Minoan Greece had writing but it remains undecipherable so it is quite impossible to determine if they preserved the connection between the pictograph and Venus. Certainly it is telling that Egypt did not preserve the connection to Venus even though their texts are virtually the same age as those of Uruk/Sumer. Following Rens's methodology, then, one might be inclined to dismiss the evidence linking this pictograph to Venus because it is "geographically limited to the ancient Near East." Yet who among us would consider this a wise choice?

evcochrane
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by evcochrane » Sat May 01, 2021 3:39 pm

A correction to my previous post: I stated that Inanna's comet-like pictograph disappeared "from the script" after the early period when I should have said that it disappeared from religious cult after about 3000 BCE. The sign continued to denote Inanna/Venus in the cuneiform script for several millennia. Please excuse the brain cramp.

Earl Sinclair
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by Earl Sinclair » Sat May 01, 2021 5:02 pm

I'm new here, so be kind....I've been making my way through the "Discourses on an Alien Sky" series in YouTube, and in general following the discussions here. One question I have regarding the recurring pictographs / cave drawings of "cosmic wheels" that do look very similar. The question is - do we see any depictions of this in societies that did not have the wheel?
I know that North American Indians [sic] did not have the wheel - but are there Anastazi or Hopi, or whatever cave drawings that include that wheel?

Thanks,

Earl

evcochrane
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Re: Polar Configuration/Axis Mundi: SOURCES, MECHANICS & DISCUSSION

Unread post by evcochrane » Sat May 01, 2021 10:38 pm

Thanks much for your interest and question Earl. The answer is yes, wheel-like petroglyphs are found all across America in indigenous cultures that never knew the wheel. So, too, such images predate the actual invention of the wheel in Old Europe.

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